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SELLC


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The problems with Obama-Care
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While Obama keeps pushing for a Medical Power-Grab that he likes to call healthcare reform I figured why not give insight into why his plan isnt worth the paper its printed on.

1st off Obama-Care is not giving insurance to people. It is mearly making it manditory with a fine should you choose not to purchase it. Should you decide not to purchase you will have to pay a fine. If you dont have insurance and you need serious medical care you will still likley be bankrupted by the cost of treatment and in addition you will have a nice government fine to pay on top of that.

While some people choose not to buy insurance, some folks simpily just cant afford it. To these people we will be strapping them with government fines. Large familys are whom will really take a hit, as this fine is per head. Obama is doing NOTHING to ensure people have coverage, he is only mandating that people buy it.

People with insurance should realize that their insurance cost will only rise when folks with pre-existing conditions are no longer kept out of their insurance pools. Right now people have a choice, taking away that choice or fining them for it is taking away freedom. Any way you slice it this plan will penalize folks whom are healthy and the people whom pay to maintain an insurance plan now.

I really dispise Obama and his Administration for this underhanded attempt to squeeze the American people for FINE MONEY and then not really giving them anything in return. There are MUCH BETTER WAYS of finding a way to cover people with pre-existing conditions and making health care plans more affordable.

This heathcare bill will set a precident that government can mandate anything, and given last years flu shot shake up, Id rather not be forced to accepting what big drug companies will likley force on Americans in the name of keeping cost down. I did not opt to get the Swine Flu shot, however you can bet that under Obama care these sorts of things will be required or you will have to pay a fine. This is only the start. Obama would like to warm people up to the idea that government knows best when it comes to healthcare, when really it's just kick-back city for a handfull of lawmakers, while the rest of the nation gets the shaft.

Obama and his administration seem more like Tyrants in this healtcare endevor.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyrant

I think many people will live to hate Obama for this should his healthcare plan get passed. There is really NO plus side to what he is offering unless you currently have a pre-existing condition.

I encorage ANYONE to list here a true plus to the Obama care bill outside of insuring people whom are known to rack up serious medical bills. I have also heard absoultly NOTHING regarding Dental insurance. I have never gotten the impression that Obama has gave a $hit about Americans outside of what they can do for him. I think he is a rotten miserable person whom has no problems sticking it to the American public to further his agenda.



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PowerStroker


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I don't think you realize that a big part of the plan is subsidies from the government to make healthcare more affordable. The non partisan Congressional Budget Office projects this plan will actually decrease healthcare costs for working and middle class people. This combined with the fact that you will no longer be denied for pre-existing conditions actually INCREASES your individual power and freedom. Healthy Republicans are under some kind of illusion that they have individual power. It isn't until they obtain a pre-existing condition that they realize - albeit too late, just how powerless they really are.

Rex, it's not you vs the Government. It's actually you vs the insurance companies. The Government is the only method through which We The People can truly exercise our power against the corporations.

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SELLC


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Empty promises. There are built in methods within Obama-Care to limit folks with pre-existing and terminal conditions. If your going to die, your going to die. No amount of money is going to change that fact.

CBO projections are an absolute JOKE! You can not rely on CBO Projections and its been proven in the past! For you to mention that they project that their idea's will lower cost for health insurance is a big fat joke indeed.

It is the government that does not allow insurance companies to compete across state lines, so your statement about the governement saving us from insurance companies is a buch of Bull! It is free enterprise that will lower cost of healthcare.

Anyone who backs Obama care is a complete idiot, and should be called out when the reality of all that I am saying comes full circle.

Once again! Obama-Care is not giving insurance to people that dont have it! Obama care is making insurance manditory, OR ELSE!

If you can not afford insurance now, there is a damn good chance you wont be able to afford it if this bill passes. Absoultly nothing will change when you enter the emergency room without insurance, you will still be charged up the rear and if you dont have the money it will still bankrupt you. In addition to all of that hardship you will now have a government fine to pay.

Obama care is making me sick!



-- Edited by SELLC on Sunday 7th of March 2010 05:25:11 PM

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If you don't like the non-partisan CBO's math, who's math do you like?

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SELLC


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POWERSTROKER!

Math is this.... 2+2 = 4

What you fail to realize about the CBO, non-partisan or not is they are "Projecting". Speculation is NOT MATH. You may as well run down to your local Casino and let your money ride!

The CBO does not have a crystal ball! Therefore you can not call what they are doing math. You are a fool if you think they can see the future.

I like the math of ACTUAL HARD DATA. End of the year math. The kind that WILL NOT CHANGE, the kind that is not based on speculation.

What say you democrats just remove the limitations that insurance companies have to compete across state lines for the next year... Then at the start of 2011 we can use that HARD DATA to see if it has lowerd healthcare premiums, rather than speculate, why dont you PERFORM!? Oh I forgot, this is all just a big power grab bullshit smoke screen.

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They use hard data and math to make projections, and they can almost always project what their margin of error will be in their projections. The head of the GAO has a PhD in math.
Congress can't make policy without projections. Would you prefer them to just shoot from the hip and be all surprised when the bill shows up?

On another note, the OMB (Office of Management and Budget) Director has a PhD in economics and has determined that failure to reform our healthcare system will bankrupt the US government in our lifetime.

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SELLC


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PowerStroker... The government is already bankrupt.

PhD's mean very little to me... RESULTS will trump a PhD any day.

All of the people whom have been running the CBO and OMB have had PhD's in the past as well, so how the hell did we get here?

Quit trying to shift the focus off what will go down as the biggest rip off in American history. This healthcare bill is so mis-represented its not even funny. You will live to eat your words PowerStroker.

-- Edited by SELLC on Sunday 7th of March 2010 05:51:06 PM

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SELLC wrote:

PowerStroker... The government is already bankrupt.

Not yet it's not

PhD's mean very little to me... RESULTS will trump a PhD any day.

From someone with a HS diploma, sigh.

All of the people whom have been running the CBO and OMB have had PhD's in the past as well, so how the hell did we get here?

Because Bush didn't listen to them when he wanted to go to war and cut taxes for millionares without finding a way to pay for it.

Quit trying to shift the focus off what will go down as the biggest rip off in American history. This healthcare bill is so mis-represented its not even funny. You will live to eat your words PowerStroker.

I will likely require some kind of healthcare if I'm ever going to dream of living that long.

-- Edited by SELLC on Sunday 7th of March 2010 05:51:06 PM



 



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SELLC


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rofl.gif

Does Bill Gates have a degree? I seem to recall him doing quite well. clueless.gif

I think it has been said many times over that everything is Bush's fault. Your cat died? It's Bush's fault... Your car broke down? It's Bush's fault. The Democrats failed? You guessed it, Bush's fault. I think you guys have worn that one out... Try something else.

Don't they offer healthcare at that dealership your working for PowerStroker? You are aware that Obama isnt GIVING people insurance arent you? You are aware that he is only mandating that you buy it right?





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SELLC


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LOL

I like this one better myself,



And this one is pretty good too... On topic as well!



-- Edited by SELLC on Sunday 7th of March 2010 07:29:14 PM

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PogoPossum


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There's no free lunch... every perk has a price tag... The price tag is carried by the taxpayer...

You guys build bombs.. Canada does different stuff.

My universal health care covers basic stuff. I still carry another medical plan for extended coverage...  (prescriptions, dental, optical... ). But somebody has to sign the cheque for even basic universal health care... and that person is the taxpayer...

HELLOOOOOOO! Is anybody in there?

Let Iraq blow itself to bits in some Jihad fucking thing... stay home and attend to the business at hand instead of trying to be the hall monitor for planet fucking earth.

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That is easy for people in Canada and Mexico to say, they are safe butted up with a world super power. Should war break out in Canada who's bombs do you guys plan on using to defend yourself?

I'd say let them idiots in Iraq kill themselfs too, and given Obama's time table for pulling out of Iraq that's just what they will do.

I am very supprised that you have to carry additional insurance Pogo, this is all news to me. I figured you guys were like England where all medical expences were picked up, but I guess I was wrong. Sure does shead some light on why this plan of Obama's is not likley the best idea. Last time I was in Canada they had KILLER taxes, now you tell me that on top of that you have to kick in for half was decent insurance as well!? Thanks for the rude awakening.

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PogoPossum


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Killer taxes? Can't say for sure without something to gauge it against. I paid between 10 and 20% in provincial and federal taxes last year but I get some tax breaks that most don't. Even then I can win a lottery (oh how I wish) without Revenue Canada crawling up my ass.

As far as living next door to a borderline phsyco? You guys scare the fuck out of me in some respects. With all of the problems that you have at home that aren't being adressed, you have the chutzpah to bury your fucking nose in everyone elses business... Physician heal thyself. Once you fix your fucking problems, only then can to you pretend to help me fix mine...

FWIW, the US has always been happy to have Canada as a buffer zone between her and the USSR.

We couldn't have won the European theater (WW2) without help from the US... But it took far too much to get you guys involved... and then you guys decided that YOU won the war in spite of everyone elses efforts...

And then, with a big fucking chip on your shoulder, you squandered the lives of your young men and women in a "police action" to save some God-foresaken jungle property.

That kind of "help".... well, I can do without it....

Something really amazing... it appears that you think universal health care is <FREE>.  There is a cadre of doctors... good doctors... successful doctors... doctors that graduated in the top half of their class doctors just waiting to go to work for free....

Sorry, skippy. They don't exist. Somewhere, somehow, someone is signing a cheque (this is a surprise???).

Canada learned, a LONG time ago.... if you don't piss people off, there is a real good chance you wont have to shoot at them...

Before you brand me as "unmanly" there's still about 4 boxes of 30.06 FMJ tucked away (if that's what it takes to be manly) even though I prefer the lever action 3030 as a "bush gun".

-- Edited by PogoPossum on Monday 8th of March 2010 02:52:17 AM

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SELLC


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The killer taxes I was speaking of were "Sales" taxes Pogo. I have no idea what people in Canada pay in income taxes, however you seem to have given me some insight into that figure @ 10-20%

I am well aware that the money to cover people with basic insurance has to come from somewhere, however under Obama's plan he is not providing people with "Basic" insurance. What he will provide people with is a fine if they dont purchase it.

With regards to Vietnam, I was not even born so I am not the person with whom to be speaking with about them days. I was also not around when the Korean War went down either. I can only assume they had their reasons and hope things never come to such a state again.

I dont really consider Canada a buffer to the USSR given the purchase of Alaska, and the entire West coast could be considered to be close enough as well.

What I do know is this.... If it werent for America getting involved Canada might find itself the focus of other radical/hostile nations. Canada might think it's shit dont stink, but I am sure you guys do your fair share of pissing people off.

Your gun collection sounds like a moose hunters collection. Perhaps even the occasional Carabu. My choice of rifles is the 308, however its awful hard to use one of them in the city without running the risk of taking out your neighbor after the bullet exits the intruder. My hand gun of choice is the S&W .40 cal. My kids swear by the crossman air rifle even though they cant even muster the power to make it past 4 pumps. LOL

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