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Post Info TOPIC: Got Denied again for the Small Business Administration EIDL loan!
Does the Government / SBA treat real small business poorly? [4 vote(s)]

Yes
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No
0.0%
Don't know
25.0%


UNSTOPPABLE!

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Got Denied again for the Small Business Administration EIDL loan!


Have you tried getting a bank loan?

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Yes, the business gets $2000-$5000 mini loans from our card processor, Square a few times a year... the entire amount of them loans are taken as a percentage of our credit card sales per transaction. Had almost ten, paid all of them back and just on the tail end of paying off our last one which is some $800 remaining.

I have also gotten a company Business charge card from AMEX... it was at one time no pre-set spending limit but they whacked me down to $5000 per month every since I tried to buy a Cadillac with it from the dealership. Something about them not liking the way I went about it, which I thought was odd because what business of it was theirs? I think they just wanted an excuse to take away my "pay over time" feature and to whack my line. Nice thing about the AMEX business is it does not show up on my personal credit report, neither does the Square loan. This is exactly the point I'm trying to make about how unfair it is for small business when it comes to figuring out DTI for loans! Small business is for sure going to have to personally invest, unless the Government gives them a boat load of seed money. 

Just before COVID in late 2019 my personal creditors decided to give me a near $40k haircut, so everything that was well under 30% utilization was now above 80%! So I started paying them off one by one, and one by one they cut the limits on the cards I would pay down! It's almost like the banks knew this COVID was going to hit well in advance! 

If you remember I took out a small HELOC just before COVID to do some home renovations, well that ended up helping out a lot since the $5000 in PPP money wasn't exactly going to feed the family for an entire year... but now I still need to make some renovations and I'll be damned if anyone will allow me to restructure. I'd understand if I had late payments, but I dont! I'd understand if I was overextened but I'm not! The equity and collateral are there, my assets, inventory and equipment are paid for (but on my credit peronally), the accounts receivables are there with backing tax forms with a solid history of $80-$100k in sales and service a year. I could very well have everything paid off in two or three years if this inflation keeps up but this is all just a way to ensure small business like me isn't getting a good rate while the market is hot and rates are low. But they been giving BIG MONEY to companies that were going to fail even before the pandemic! Many of them that have gotten huge loans have failed, or will fail soon! 

They bank on the idea that people will not call them out, but I'm all aces! They have NOTHING! No late payments, no negatives, good history, solid collateral, backing records and proofs and 20 years in business! 

THEY ARE JUST FUCKING CROOKED! FLAT THE FUCK OUT!

 



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Well in fairness, If I were Amex and extended credit to a small business in a manner that would not have any effect on anyone's personal credit report. And then an attempt was made to purchase a Cadillac with that credit... I might suspect the purpose of said Cadillac isn't business related, and I too might get worried that the credit I intended to extend to a small business, was instead used as an unsecured car loan. Indeed, that would piss me off.

I guess my point is, if in practice there is no real separation between your business and personal finances, then why make such an effort to have credit that doesn't affect your personal report? I'd bet with your payment history you could qualify for pretty much any loan you want, just long as it is a secured loan that DOES affect your personal credit report.



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Company buys cars all the time! Just had a little Ford Focus ZX3 that a customer sold us when they got a new car! The new owner was very happy with it after we cleaned it up and made the needed repairs!

And that Cadillac would have sold in this market right about now for about $5,000 more than what I would have paid for it back then! So FUCK AMEX and whatever BS reasons they might have! They can go fuck themselves because I pay them off every month! That's why it's called a "charge" card! I would have just rolled it into a personal loan but I didn't have the time to beat the bushes at my local banks. Doesn't matter anyway, I had the cash to buy it outright, only the dealer listed and sold a car they didn't even have the title for!

escalade.jpg

Are you suggesting ANY of this is MY fault as a customer of both AMEX and the Cadillac Dealership? Honestly! What did I do wrong?



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PowerStroker wrote:



I guess my point is, if in practice there is no real separation between your business and personal finances, then why make such an effort to have credit that doesn't affect your personal report? I'd bet with your payment history you could qualify for pretty much any loan you want, just long as it is a secured loan that DOES affect your personal credit report.


 

Um... are you kidding me? I thought I just explained that in some detail!

There is no real seperation between my business and my personal because when I loan the business money it has to pay me back! When I do work for the company it has to pay me!

And how much more secure of collateral can you get than REAL ESTATE? You have to be kidding me! 

I'm getting denied on the personal AND business side! All because I'm a small business owner! And this is not something I am just assuming, they all flat out tell me that my credit re-payment history is excellent but they can't loan me money because I am self employed!

Some places, like Figure Lending, have listed as being "self-employed" an immediate disqualifying factor in getting a loan with them, and that's on the personal side on a home with over $100k equity!



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Well I don't have enough information to make a determination either way. I'm just suggesting that a possible reason why Amex did what they did, is they may have been afraid that their business charge card was being used to finance unsecured personal expenses. Which would make sense, because if they saw a long history of you using it to purchase auto parts, which they could assume you are installing and reselling for a profit as part of your business model, and then suddenly it was being used to buy a Cadillac at a dealership, with no title lien or any protections for them, it might raise some red flags on their end. It really kind of depends on what information you provided them about your business when you got the charge card. I'm sure you probably had to tell them the nature of your business is auto repair, but did you also disclose that you also "flip" vehicles as part of your business, and tell them up front that you intended to use their financing to purchase vehicles for flipping? Do you have a dealer license that allows you to reassign a title to the next buyer without first registering it in your name? These are the kinds of things Amex probably would want to know before they start financing vehicle purchases with an unsecured business charge card. At least these are the things I would like to know up front if I were in the business of lending money to small businesses.

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SELLC wrote:
 

There is no real seperation between my business and my personal because when I loan the business money it has to pay me back! When I do work for the company it has to pay me!

 


 

And here is a much bigger problem... The ONLY way having a LLC actually protects you personally, is if you have an ABSOLUTE separation between business and personal finances. Once that firewall is breached, the LLC will not shield you personally against anything.



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Well first off, my business does not get into routine "flipping" of vehicles... however in the course of business it's not uncomon for a repair shop to come into possestion of a vehicle, either by way of a mechanics lein or an outright purchase of a customers vehicle who does not want to fix their vehicle and sells it to us to avoid inspection and or repair fees. In these cases we DO-NOT re-assign titles, the vehicle is titled in the companies name and then used for business purposes and or re-sold.

And with regards to the AMEX being an un-secured business card, AMEX might not report the balance or payment history on my personal credit but if I was late or didn't make payment you can bet your sweet ass they would! Fact is AMEX likes to act like a big player but they really can't even handle a $10k charge... in fact any time you make a really big purchase they want you to "check your spending power," which I did to the tune of $10k prior to my purchase! According to the website I was all good to spend $10k until the time came for them to pony up! And in all honesty, had the dealership have had the title and I was relying on them soley to purchase said Cadillac, they would have cost me about $5k in profits today! Even on the low end I would have been able to drive the vehicle for two years and get ALL my money back and then some! 

But this thread isn't about AMEX! It's about the SBA saying I am not creditworthy enough for a business loan! What business is not creditworthy enough for an SBA loan is carrying around an AMEX Platinum Business card with membership started and in excellent standing since 2017? 

It's all bullshit, you're getting pissy just like all the lenders I talk to when they can't find a single late payment or derogatory... and when I tear them down they start getting all defensive coming up with some hypothetical BS just like you're doing right now.

Just go ahead and say it PowerStroker! I'm an asshole and they don't want to lend to assholes! LOL

Do you think being an asshole is a good enough reason to decline someone credit? Because there are lots of other small business out there with a lot worse credit re-payment history and in a HELL OF A LOT MORE debt than I am and they are getting SBA loans and Mortgages!



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Well, I guess my main point is this... If as you say, there is no separation between your business and personal finances, why bother going to the SBA? Just go to a bank and get a loan in your own name.

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"If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you."     Lyndon B. Johnson

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Hell... AMEX can't even maintain their original credit lines! That goes for Citi Bank, HSBC, FNBO (Formerly, First National Bank of Omaha),  and Barclays! ALL of these creditors have a history of not being able to maintain their original lines and chasing balances.

The only GOOD creditors that have been able to maintain their credit lines have been Discover, Capital One, Credit One, and Merrick. Just an FYI...

I've also hit my Discover card for purchases OVER $10k without them blinking an eye or having to "check my spending power".

So at the end of the day you have your responsible lenders and your scumbags... unfortunately as a small business person I have to deal with them both... but I try and make sure the good ones are making the most interest if there is any to be made.

 



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PowerStroker wrote:

Well, I guess my main point is this... If as you say, there is no separation between your business and personal finances, why bother going to the SBA? Just go to a bank and get a loan in your own name.


 

Ah HEM... Zoolander...

I have already explained... I am a small business owner, I can't go to the bank and ask for a loan in my name for the business because they only use my "after" tax income! Don't you get that!?

The amount of my schedule C is what the business spends on parts, bills, equipment and utilities, rent and everything else! How can I go to the bank and ask for a personal loan for my business when they wont take into consideration the money the business makes to service it's bills, bills that are in MY NAME personally? That's just crazy!

The same for a refiance of my home on the personal side! They say my DTI is out of whack because they claim the Government only lets them look at "after tax" income to service the mortgage, but when you are carrying the business on your personal they wont take into consideration the money the business pays to service it's debts because it's on a schedule C and listed as a "deduction".

Is this over your head PowerStroker? I can dumb it down more for you.



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PowerStroker wrote:

 

And here is a much bigger problem... The ONLY way having a LLC actually protects you personally, is if you have an ABSOLUTE separation between business and personal finances. Once that firewall is breached, the LLC will not shield you personally against anything.


 

So long as I am working as a mechanic there will never be an ABSOLUTE seperation of anything... however once I do branch out and have people working for the company, then the LLC and business insurance would kick in to take liability off me, so long as my mechanic # isn't on the invoice as the tech... 

I'm not set up as an LLC because I'm trying to dodge my accountability the way Doctors and Lawyers do in their "practices". I'm set up as an LLC because I wanted the foundation and flexibility to expand the business into more than just myself and the family. 

Even if I just work until I'm 65 I'll retire with a paid off home and social security if there is anything left in the fund! LOL

But I'd rather work beyond 65, and I think if I was treated fairly by the Government and lenders that I could be there 15 years sooner... I'm already raising my labor rate to $100 this December, I'm trimming fat and working pretty much 24/7 with the exception of eating, sleeping, and bullshitting on this forum. Since I live next door to where I work I'm pretty much "on the job" at any given moment, unless I'm taking a shit or sleeping! And it's been that way since March 2020!



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And I should mention that sometimes when I'm taking a shit I'll take a business call or text...

So really the only time I'm not "on the job" is when I'm sleeping or in the shower...

 



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Whoa...I think this thread is giving me your head-ache SELLC !!!

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It is what it is Rastus...

I think I'll take a midnight tour of the town with the top down in the Corvette and lick my wounds... maybe buy a pack of bubble gum with my AMEX Platinum... but I'll be sure to "Check my spending Power" first.



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Enjoy the last of your warm weather mate !

Corvette summer.jpg

 



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Thanks Rastus! Although I'm not sure if I'm crazy about them mudflaps on that corvette you have posted above... lol, for the record I don't have mud flaps on my sports car! LOL

I didn't end up going on any midnight ride that night though, it's already getting bone cold here at nights! Plus my kid was parked behind me... Beautiful during the day though! A few more weeks and I'll have to put her away for the winter.

I'm just waiting to see what happens with the debt ceiling before I take any more action with the SBA... the last thing I want is my information floating around with these clowns during a shutdown... lord knows what kind of hacking goes on when the government is shut down, I mean they get hacked even when they're not shut down so you can only imagine.

The way these banks have been treating me, the SBA included - I hope they ALL go bust and the market sinks into the abyss... I've got enough stock (read that as inventory of tangible goods, not paper stocks) that if hyper-inflation takes hold my current debt will be paid off quickly!

The crooked SBA and Banks are due for a good ass whooping, they have lost their way... the Government that has been propping them up needs a good spanking too!



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So I finally got something from the SBA about the EIDL loan... they sent me a link to their portal where I was able to securely upload documents without having to email them to responding agents, which I wasn't going to do anyway due to the risks of sending stuff thru regular email. 

Now we wait for another excuse... Or if they approve me it will be some ridiculously low amount.

Meanwhile I'm still paying my bills on time, trying to survive in what can only be called the biggest shit-show I have ever seen in my life due to COVID and unnecessary lockdowns. 

But all the big business's are doing great! They all got their massive bail out loans at near zero interest and the lions share of the SBA's PPP, EIDL and grant money...

And the stock market? DOING GREAT! The more people sell, the more Government buys! 



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Well it's been almost a month now... and I thought I was slow!

But now the SBA is sending me email asking me to re-consider other loan applications (remember I have filed three for the EIDL since COVID started) and I just don't understand it... the people at the SBA on the phone said they will only re-consider original applications and the rules seem somewhat made up as we go along. I think it's safe to put a fork in this organization because honestly the SBA is a very good example of bureaucratic waste and corruption at best!

The PPP loans were actually distributed and processed by my local bank, so it was smooth with regular and prompt follow thru! But anything left to the SBA might as well just be considered only for insiders and friends of lobiest PERIOD.

In fact, we can almost be sure that ANY loan given by the SBA will be to a company they know is probably going to go under... For example, if you have been in business for under 10 years and have been renting your space and struggling well before the pandemic you have a pretty good chance of getting a large EIDL loan! If you're a company that has been in business for over 20 years with flawless repayment history that is just looking to re-struture existing debt at a better interest rate who is not renting their space and was not in trouble before the pandemic you can be pretty sure you'll be denied, unless you know someone in Politics who knows someone in the SBA... because that's what I have seen.

These idiots at the SBA aren't worth the money they are being entrusted. They are not only incompetent but they are a WASTE of your tax paying dollars! For example, the SBA will just GIVE AWAY $10k to a business, but never actually make a loan to that same business to recoupe said money with a lucrative larger loan that would not only recoup tax payer dollars, but earn tax payers interest! It's like the Government gets a pass! Why do these miserable cock suckers get a pass? A corporation has to make a profit for it's shareholders who invest, but for some reason the Government can run DEEP in the red borrowing every year? It's enough to make me wonder if we all didn't make a big mistake and should have voted for Hillary! At least her horny husband was able to balance the budget! Even if he did cook a book or two and got a blow job! LOL

I'm at my wits end with the SBA... They can go fuck themselves at this point! I'm not interested any further.

I think they are a sorry ass government agency that is long since lost it's way!

Not a single person has come on this forum in support of the SBA... Not ONE SINGLE person! I think that says a lot.

LET'S GO BRANDON!



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And I don't feel ONE BIT bad about the $10k in PPP loans they have FORGIVEN!

That's right! Had they been a stand up Government outfit they would have followed that up with a $100,000 business loan at their 3% interest rate and a closing cost equal to the amount of money received in the PPP program! (Remember these are 30 year loans)

BUT THEY DIDN'T! And I am not going to feel one bit bad about it as charity, or as justification for overlooking their complete and total incompetence in business! We might as well call them the "Stupid Business Administration" from here on out!

I don't want to disrespect the taxpayers who ultimatly will fund the $10k that the SBA dolled out, and to them people I thank you from the bottom of mine and the companies heart! But you should know, I was prepared to make the company pay every single DIME of that $10k PPP loan back, WITH INTEREST, if the SBA did the right thing and gave me a big enough loan to restructure the business debt that I hold personally and allow us the ability to AT LEAST expand our operations and perhaps hire in and train new people that would also be paying into the tax coffers too! Not only that, more property taxes and at minimum at least that $10k would have come back to you with interest! But I agree giving the lions share of the money to BIG BUSINESS was much safer, except I thought I was dealing with the SMALL business Administration. 

When the shit hits the fan and big business stocks are down, interest is up and inflation thru the roof at least I won't have to deal with the general public as I remain private. I won't have to worry about more property taxes, payroll, and all that other nonsense. I will remain small and nimble enough to navigate the obstacles the Government throws in the road ahead as it tries to socialize every aspect of our lives! Because let's be honest, BANKS really should be doing this job... but they can't, because they are regulated and owned by the Government who allows us all the privilege of existing. LOL

That's all I got on the miserable SBA... unless something else turns up I think I'm done with that organization. 

If you have had a good experience with the SBA feel free to share it here! I'll be waiting!

 

As an edit, I wanted to disclose these numbers as researched online as of todays date.

Average PPP loan size = $107,000

https://www.sba.gov/sites/default/files/2020-07/PPP%20Results%20-%20Sunday%20FINAL.pdf

Average EIDL loan size = $168,000

https://helloskip.com/blog/breaking-eidl-loan-increase-total-approval-numbers/ 

Just incase people were starting to think I was being unreasonable in my request... seem's I'm WELL under the threshold, or "average" when it comes to the EIDL amount requested and LESS THAN 10% of the average on the forgiven PPP loan.

I didn't want anyone thinking I was being unreasonable... all I want is what I have coming to me, I all want is my fair share! LOL

 



-- Edited by SELLC on Wednesday 27th of October 2021 07:50:53 PM

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I'd suggest that PowerStroker hit-the-nail on-the-head a few posts ago, with the way that the banks see how you use them. ( Which I think is fair enough however ).

It's good to see that you're very busy, so I'd suggest keeping extra $$$ under-the-bed.

It doesn't make any sense to get into debt, & payback money with interest.

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Rastus wrote:

(1) I'd suggest that PowerStroker hit-the-nail on-the-head a few posts ago, with the way that the banks see how you use them. ( Which I think is fair enough however ).

(2) It's good to see that you're very busy, so I'd suggest keeping extra $$$ under-the-bed.

(3) It doesn't make any sense to get into debt, & payback money with interest.


 

(1) If what you mean by how the banks see how I use the money means I shouldn't get paid for the work I perform, in the capacity of the person who not only gets paid commission to actually fix the cars, but also to bill, sell, find parts and wear all the hats - along with put my OWN personal money into things like equipment and overhead then I'd say YOU, PowerStroker and the miserable cock sucking banks have been hit too hard in the head with the hammer! In simple terms, FOOK YOU! I have just as much right to be paid as some dude working for the Government or in the Union! If they, or any of you have hurt feelings you can quit your job and try it! Will you make it 20 years as I have? Overall odd's have it set up where most of you won't make it past the first few years! 

(2) It's feast or famine, that's the American way.

(3) I guess you're just not paying attention... I'm trying to LOWER my business interest costs down to the 3.75% interest rate that this program is offering and spread it out over 30 years. There is NOTHING wrong with a business borrowing money! Apple has over a Trillion in value and STILL borrows to fund it's opperations! The fact that I am treated unfairly in the underwriting both on the business AND the personal side is because people like you, PowerStroker and the Bankers seem to think it's easy... TRY IT and get back to us... PowerStroker did, he couldn't quite quit his day job to support even HIMSELF! I shoud have you know Rastus, and anyone else reading, that I currently support a family of FOUR (not including myself)... along with a Rabbit, a Lizzard, Two Turtless and a few dozen fish! Right now I'm having to struggle with things because of Government lockdowns and incompetence that has seen some of the most ridiculous bullshit the world has ever seen in this generation. Meanwhile they doll out MILLIONS to scam artist so they can buy Lamborghini's and the Federal Reserve is printing money left and right so Politicans can buy themselves bigger and better homes! Even Joe Biden is having a fence installed around his house that will cost more than ten times what my business is asking for! I think it's just so the ignorant fuck doesn't wander off when he is wandering aimlessly in his back yard.

So yeah, I think I hit the nail on the head in calling all you jealous fucks who would think a hard working guy like myself is somehow living large driving around 20+ year old cars and living in a house that was built in the 1950's! It's only because I'm good at what I do, not because the Government come around passing out chump change while they tried to torpedo the nations small businesses with half assed relief loans! I don't even want to get into how much money was wasted on Solyndra!

Wonder how the wanna-be Stellar Enterprises is doing who got the $3,000,000 USDA loan for power washing paint off with frozen ice, rather than water? That is some GREEN shit right there! LOL! Let's freeze the fucking water and now it's a considered a "green" initiative.

https://autotrend.activeboard.com/t33799937/stellar-enterprises-llc-michigan-gets-3000000-million-relief/

Naw... I'm a driver - I'm a winner! Things are gonna change I can feel it!

I'm gonna show all of you guys, and then you'll see... You'll ALL see!



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Rastus wrote:

I'd suggest that PowerStroker hit-the-nail on-the-head a few posts ago, with the way that the banks see how you use them. ( Which I think is fair enough however ).


 

And I should mention, Rastus, that PowerStroker was not talking about the SBA... he was eluding to a transaction for a used Cadillac with AMEX which I had intended as a company car anyway... Apparently AMEX can't handle the big transactions like they brag about! They want advanced notice, and even when you give it to them they still welch... No matter though, Discover had my back and didn't blink an eye! Now if only the Dealership had the title for the vehicle they were trying to sell me! At closing I brought cash, the Dealership came up short! That vehicle would be worth at least what I would have paid for it in todays market, if not a nice little profit come this winter when it's 4WD was really in demand! They all cost me money, and yet they all wanted to act like big players, only they come up short... at my expense. Guess the Judge didn't want to hurt his relationship with the Cadillac dealership because of my piddly ass $10k failed deal. Guess you just got to take some on the chin, as not to shit where you eat and sleep... and that's how I've been able to swallow it.

But this brings me to my next point, companies like American Express and that CEO Stephen Squeri running his cock sucker on Yahoo all the time... Do you know Rastus, that after American Express AMEX welched on approving my already approved large purchase they whacked the companies credit line from "No pre-set spending limit" to only $5,000! They also took away my ability to "pay over time" which means they really aren't all that and a bag of chips! I am currently dragging AMEX and making them sit on $4k worth of purchases until my actual due date! Why you might ask? Because it's bullshit I pay them $600 a year for a $5k credit line! But what is the business going to do? The Government sure ain't doing shit! So this low ass limit can't even handle my current work load, and hasn't for several months! What has remained consistant is my paying off the bill in full every month! So they can sit on that $4k for another two weeks, I have the cash just sitting in my account! But it's the principal! AMEX crawls up peoples asses all time you would think they would know when they are under-serving a customer! But no... Instead they get that sorry ass Stephen Squeri on Yahoo Finance and he acts like he's some big shit, talking shit about BitCoin like his companies AMEX shares are even worth a fraction of a percent of what a BitCoin is, even in a down cycle! 

And I have had MANY of AMEX personal cards that all had their limits cut around that time too! And we're talking about 60-80% cuts in lines! For what? I've never been late, and my utilization was never an issue until they lowered my lines down to preditory limits! I mean really, how much does it take to max out $900 credit line? And even if you pay it off in two payments, it still makes you look high in utilization! It's a fucking joke! 

I may lose sleep at night and worry a lot about how to balance making money with getting the customer the best price and service possible, but at the end of the day AMEX is very much my bitch! Same goes for any other creditor who is sucking off my teat making a living off what get's left on the table in interest, which is written off in most cases because I don't do anything but work or post on this forum!

I'm currently on wood-stove duty... I got so busy I didn't even have time to get my furnace replaced. I have a brand new one sitting in the living room but because I have to carry all this business overhead personally I can't get re-financed to get home improvements done! I did have a nice chunk of change from a HELOC one month before the pandemic hit, but guess where them funds were re-directed? You guessed it! Because no way I was living on that $5,000 annual PPP disbursement! 

Maybe Hyper-Inflation will change everything like Jack Dorsey said... Maybe it will crash the markets and bring these greedy crooks to their knees and allow me to pay them all off sooner and for far less! If that's the case then at least I know what creditors I can trust and which ones I can't! I mean, I've always known the SBA was as useless as tits on a bull... but I always had this image of AMEX being a good company... Funny how the smaller card companies have been the only ones not to extend lines beyond what they can handle, and thus have never resorted to preditory line decreases... I guess the big banks didn't get rich playing by the rules, and they sure would have lost a LOT of money in interest over the past year and a half if ANY bank or lender allowed me to restructure at a 3% rate, be it a small business loan or personal home loan re-finance. I could sell all my assets and have over $100k in liquidity easy, but then where am I going to live? What am I going to drive? Where am I going to work? It's all relative Rastus! Got four people counting on me over here, not including myself or the household pets! LOL, I don't have any patience for these peoples BULLSHIT! 



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You're missing the point SELLC...

If you own everything, & owe the banks nothing, you're miles ahead, since you're not in debt...

Save your bux, & once you have over say 50K in there, & no debts, they'll offer you heaps in loans, if that's what you want, though I wonder why.

Irrespective however, the banks will only ever loan you approx. 2.8 - 3.1 times your gross annual wages...And typically, that's only for a house-loan...

This means that if your gross wage is 100-K PA, they'll possibly lend you around 300-K.

Your best bet is to try & get a 2nd mortgage, & buy another house similar to your own, & rent-it-out...Then one day arrives when you can buy another, & another, & another...

You do this money juggling for a number of years, usually until you're sick-of-it, & want to retire. Then you cash-in all-your chips, & see how much "real money" you're left with.

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Rastus wrote:

You're missing the point SELLC...

If you own everything, & owe the banks nothing, you're miles ahead, since you're not in debt...

You're absolutly spot on with this one.

Save your bux, & once you have over say 50K in there, & no debts, they'll offer you heaps in loans, if that's what you want, though I wonder why.

True.

Irrespective however, the banks will only ever loan you approx. 2.8 - 3.1 times your gross annual wages...And typically, that's only for a house-loan...

Also True.

This means that if your gross wage is 100-K PA, they'll possibly lend you around 300-K.

All my debt combined with everything lock stock and barrel isn't even 1/2 of this. FYI home just went up to $260k in value due to inflation. So now what?

Your best bet is to try & get a 2nd mortgage, & buy another house similar to your own, & rent-it-out...Then one day arrives when you can buy another, & another, & another...

Tell that to the people who have not been able to collect rent for the past year and a half thanks to the Government making it impossible to evict. 

You do this money juggling for a number of years, usually until you're sick-of-it, & want to retire. Then you cash-in all-your chips, & see how much "real money" you're left with.

I don't want to retire! Every since that one really cold winter where I spent days in bed binging on Netflix only to find myself with bed sores and in horrible shape I decided never to let that happen again.

I'll have to always be active in some way! You have access to the V8 Cafe, you know how serious I am about my crazy! LOL


 



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SELLC said...
______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

"All my debt combined with everything lock stock and barrel isn't even 1/2 of this. FYI home just went up to $260k in value due to inflation. So now what"?
______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________


Over here in Oz, lots of people rather than renting property out, find it better to leap-frog from house to house, but with new-builds...

So...Find some land somewhere that's developing, design a home, get some numbers together to get it built, talk to the bank, & then sell once completed...

You make your money, & then do-it-again, & again & again. And as you make more money, they'll lend you more...

Should you decide to go-this-way, you'd be better-off to work at a mine as say a maintenance / mechanical fitter, where your gross income would be around 150-K PA, meaning that the banks will lend you close to 450-K.

That's one way to do it, but it means closing down your home business, & working in a mine for at least a couple-of-years. They typically work rosters of say 2-3-weeks on, with 1-week off, & 12-hr-days.

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Yeah I'm not big into land develpment or working in a mine. lol

I could be a real estate agent or a scrap metal guy - both probably the same as what you're talking... similar hours and pay too.

There is a lot of things I could be... But I'm a self employed certified master automobile mechanic.

Let's not try an re-invent the wheel because some pencil necks in the Government and Finance are jealous.

I do honest days work for an honest days pay... That is more than I can say for the people in Government and Finance... 

 



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Yo,

Your Master Certificate is what will get you into a mine, using your current skills, & spike-up your gross annual income.

Banks like to see at least 18-24 months regular work at that income level before they'll give you 450-K.

Once you've built & sold your first home, you can do it again, & then go back to your original way-of-life....But remember that you need to be able to manage the cost of the loan repayments during the build, & until the house is sold. Profits depend on outlay versus return.

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Not really into mine work... I probably work more hours than the mine workers, but I am sure their conditions are much worse... plus they are in a mine all that time... that's not quite for me...

$450k is a whole lot more than I was looking for too! I started off at $10k and figured since they were giving everyone else $165k that I'd be more than good with $100k... hell I only have $30k in revolving credit I am carrying for the business... Maybe $55k if you include all the equipment and tools.

So it's clear that the real issue here is the SBA and the Government. I'm not going to change careers or abandon my customers for the cock sucking SBA or Government! 

I still have a few tricks up my sleeve... This thread is more or less to call out the SBA and given all the facts, they have NO EXCUSE for their lack of performance and support! They are all crooks with their heads up their ass, this can be seen by how sloppy they manage their applications and how incompetent their agents are... they try and hide this by talking down to you and hanging up on you. I just send them nasty emails and post up what a disgrace they are online to keep things on an even keel. 

The SBA, AMEX, CITI, BARCLAYS and HSBC can ALL suck it! I will treat them as they have treated me and to say they treat me poorly is an understatement! When they change, I'll change.



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Yo,

With your qualifications, you'll move-up to trucks & other assorted mining equipment, typically outside the mine, not within it lol !

The idea is to generate that gross-annual-income that will allow you to borrow up-to 450-k.

I'd suggest that you could make 50-K plus on your first home...eg...

Land = 250-K

House = 150-K

Sell price = 450-500-K

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I'm not looking to borrow ANY money, the Business is! The only reason I have tried to borrow on the personal end lately had been for business capital.

The last time that I borrowed money for myself personally was to buy my car... but it's paid off now.

Still, $450k is WAY MORE than what I'd need. No interest in working in a mine, or on any of the big ass vehicles they use in mines.

I'd be more inclined to wait until the housing bubble pops before I made any moves in real estate, at least when it comes to buying... People looking to sell now and in the near future would be a good time since the market is so hot right now.

Still... Putting up $400k to maybe make $50k isn't my idea of a good business move... A small drop in property value could see all profits vanish, and yet an even bigger drop could see you lose $100k or more!

 



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Hey SELLC...

With your qualifications, you "should" be able to do some sort of work at a mine, & just do that for a couple-of-years...

Then you'll have more-than-enough money to invest in your business, with no banks, no interest to be paid, & no hassles, as your tax would have already been paid with your wages.

It does mean taking orders however for a few years.

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Yeah right Rastus, I'm going to give up my near $100k per year job now to work in a mine... ha-ha

You could always take the jab yourself and get back on the sea! If you're into that sort of thing.

We all take orders every day, for example, right now my stomach is ordering me to have lunch!



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Oh wait, actually since I am self employed and write off my business deductions I only do about $26k per year according to the SBA and banks. Seems they are the only ones that can use their gross income and the deposits and or taxes of others as net worth.

If you ask me the whole mine bit was a bit out of left field... they are closing a lot mines here in the USA under Biden! Didn't you get the memo?

They are also closing a lot of small business, resturants especially, with their shutdowns and sorry ass relief programs. 

I bet you think you're being cute, I'd imagine that is how the Government feels until it catches up with them. 

Anyway, this thread is about the SBA and how they waste tax payer money and whatnot... It's not an order, but could you please try and stay on topic?

 

 



-- Edited by SELLC on Friday 29th of October 2021 11:43:24 AM

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LOL !

I'm only politely suggesting to f*** the banks off altogether, & use your trade to earn some real money for a few years at a mine or where-ever, so you don't need them...

Folks here in Oz have no choice but to do these things if they want to live in the suburbs...( Unless of course they inherit everything like Mr.trumpdt has...And there's a lot of that too).

"Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for yourself" ;) !









-- Edited by Rastus on Friday 29th of October 2021 06:02:20 PM

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The SBA is not a bank! It's a corrupt shithole Government agency!

I tell the banks to fuck off on a regular basis Rastus! They just nod and take my money.

Look, I don't know what line of shit you're trying to run here with this whole live without the banks and working in a mine but you might as well live off the grid on the fat of the land at that point! No thanks on that!

I could give a flying fuck if the SBA gives me a dime or not, but I'm calling a spade a spade when I make these post because they are just making bad loans with tax payers money.

If they had a justifiable leg to stand on, like perhaps even a single late payment or ANY derogitory other than the fact that I am a small business person who carries business debt, then they might not be so exposed in this thread.

You and PowerStroker seem to act like I'm not already set up and established for 20 years! Acting like I don't already have ALL the equipment, tools, customers and proven performance records. 

The SBA is a fucking joke and so is everyone in the Government if they think this agency is doing right by Small Business. I'll stay small and starve the cock-suckers, don't matter to me!



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Can't believe the Government is just going to give the company $10,200 in forgiven PPP loans and stiff us on an EIDL loan!

Just got this today,

sbaforgiveness.jpg

So for the record, under Trump the company got $5100 in 2020 and under Biden (two days under Biden might I add), the company was given another $5,100 in PPP loans... Now both have been forgiven, which is nice. Thank you tax payers! While you can never get the amount of money you're really looking for, it did help. So don't take this thread the wrong way... perhaps next time we shouldn't shut down the country? Maybe...

As for the SBA and their EIDL loans, well it's looking like they will keep all that money for their insiders. 

Had it not been for the banks I doubt the SBA could have even handled it... look at how long it has taken the SBA to even re-consider our EIDL loan application from back in 2020!!!

It's really quite bittersweet... but going into the 2022 election year I'm for sure not impressed with ANYTHING Democrats have done in the small business department. Nothing more than what we got under Trump...

 



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40 years of "Get the government off the backs of small business" mentality in government probably won't result in a government that does much for small business. At least you got your free ten grand though.

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Yup



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PowerStroker wrote:

40 years of "Get the government off the backs of small business" mentality in government probably won't result in a government that does much for small business. 


 

Well then maybe they should change the name and cut all the funding to the SBA?

It's the small businesses that pay the lions share of the taxes in this country, not the welfare queen corporations that spend their tax money on lobbiest and kickbacks to politicians!

The SBA is a shit organazation! Their $5,100 a year is a laughable JOKE to expect someone to survive on alone, let alone a family of four!

That $5,100 per year went to interest! Meanwhile companies with millions and billions in reserves got MASSIVE infusions from this program! 

Fuck you any anyone else who would say the SBA is anything but a corrupt waste of tax payer money!



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I have a smaller business than yours, and never once needed anything from the SBA.

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I'm sorry PowerStroker but you have a "hobby", not a business...

And FYI, I dont NEED anything from the SBA... I'm just keeping them cocksuckers honest, much like I do with you!



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Just thought I'd update the thread... 

So it's almost been two years now trying to get an SBA EIDL loan... I suppose the comedy of jumping thru hoops the past few months since October is just to build up suspense for when they decline me again... keep in mind we're having their original decision to decline "reviewed" because lets be honest... a flawless payment history is a flawless payment history! There really is no exuse for them.

Hope they are reading this and take the time to accept my most deepest feelings of "what the heck are you people doing over there?" 

I thought this was supposed to be an "emergency" program set up for business that have been affected by COVID... I thought I was slow! These people take the cake!

It's been almost TWO YEARS of this! For the past 14 years, including the last two begging the SBA, one thing has remained the same... on time payments, every time! Why am I considered the credit risk when companies like Citi, AMEX, HSBC and others can't maintain their original introductry lines? How is that a poor reflection on me? That they can't maintain their lines? Because if they were I'd still be well under 20% utilization and that's even with me carrying the business like I was some kind of bank!



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What part of being denied the last time was confusing to you?

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The part where I had no missed payments in 14 years, taxes, fees and registrations all current/paid and almost $200k equity in my home. There has to be a reason driven by logic...

I know some people who were behind on everything, messed up credit and everything their business owned was rented... they got the EIDL loan!

But we already know there is a bad ground in your brain that won't allow you to understand things like logic and reason...

We also know your party has no shame when it comes to cheating... 

It's clear to me this Administration is no better than the last... not that I ever felt any different when I went to the polls and voted for Trump in 2020.

Happy Thanksgiving to the SBA!



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Looks like I'm not the only one to have issues with the SBA... seems they let LOTS of people get these EIDL loans without hardly any paperwork at all, including not having to submit tax returns!

Crazy! And to think I have been waiting TWO years! Thru more than FIVE variants of the COVID pandemic and jumped thru ALL of their hoops only to still be getting jerked around! 

My application has to be one of the most simple and straightforward of them ALL! With complete document backing! Yet it's been TWO YEARS!

Small businesses face 'very difficult' process for COVID aid as Omicron looms

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/small-businesses-scramble-for-sba-aid-but-face-very-difficult-process-120053736.html

The SBA will accept and review reconsideration and appeals requests received on or before December 31st if those requests are received within six months from the date of decline, and 30 days from the date of reconsideration decline for appeals, and provided funding is still available.

The agency has touted billions of dollars still available in COVID-19 relief. Yet like other SBA recovery programs with lofty intentions and high demand, business owners have found it hard to navigate the process to get the help they need.  

It is a mess. They never have a specific answer for us, Christian Friese, co-owner of Dynamic Promotions Inc. a business that sells accessories that go on the back of smartphones in Georgia told Yahoo! Finance in an interview.

Friese was approved for the EIDL program back in October, but the process to get there was a journey. It's been a very difficult process, but it shouldn't have been, Friese said.

Once we got approved and had gone through all the red tape, jumped through all their hoops and they [even] made exceptions for us [but] now they're backtracking, the entrepreneur added.

In the beginning of the pandemic, the CARES Act allowed the Small Business Administration to approve emergency disaster loans without tax records, as a means to not delay getting the financial help to struggling businesses. But the SBA is now verifying that information again, with the IRS still grappling with a backlog of millions.

On that basis, Friese said the SBA relaxed that requirement but he continues to wait for funding as his application portal shows active error," with no way to resolve it.

I call customer service on a daily basis. Everyone is like oh, just wait to hear back. Just wait and we've been waiting for months now and nobody's giving us a real answer on what they really need from us, Hanna Romaih, Frieses wife and co-owner of Dynamic Promotions, said in an interview.



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Just wanted to update everyone on the progress of this TWO YEAR long business loan application that was supposed to be set up as emergency aid for small business...

I have sent in almost SEVEN copies of my 4506T forum to the SBA thru their online portal, one of them a high resolution PDF at over 15mb! Yet every day they keep asking for a clearer copy!

What is CLEAR here is the SBA is now using erronious tacticts to delay or stall out applications!

Next year when my tax forms show that we are below the threshold, it is my intention to sue the SBA in Federal Court... This just isn't right, and although I have very little faith in the courts, it's the principal at this point.

The SBA is a complete joke, much like the current Administration...

 

As someone who has been dealing with the SBA for TWO YEARS now, thru a pandemic, making sacrifices and putting in my OWN money along the way waiting on these clowns it's VERY clear that this whole program is and was a scam! 

TWO FUCKING YEARS! For emergency aid!

Fuck these idiots! They are just playing with us now! 



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So you have enough money to sue the SBA in Federal Court, but not enough to run a business that is swimming in customers?

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Apparently that might be the case PowerStroker...

I don't know if you have taken a good look around at the state of things... havent you noticed local business operating on skeleton crews, some of them not even being able to maintain normal hours, or even open for the day?

Havent you noticed your gas prices have increased? But not just your gas, EVERYTHING else? It's one thing to have a few sectors with increased prices, but this is across the board! 

I know you don't know anything about running a business, because you just work for the man and have a little hobby going, but the shit is real... Our States Secretary of State was at one time three months behind just to transfer a title! Currently it's back to appointments only! Courts have even had problems finding jurors and as such all the courts are just packed to the gills and understaffed. Many local resturants have regular staffing issues that prevent them from opening, or sometimes even staying open until close (which was already reduced since COVID). These are BIG business and Institutions faltering PowerStroker! It's nearing what many would consider to be societal breakdown!

It wasn't easy running your own business before COVID, but let me tell you it's gotten a lot worse! 

Something is seriously wrong... You can pretend it's not, I mean look at the state of that shithole you're living now! I wouldn't want to visit there if someone PAID me! That's pretty bad PowerStroker, because I live in Metro Detroit!



__________________

A middle-aged loner on a crusade to champion the cause of the innocent, the helpless, the powerless - in a world of criminals who operate above the law.

LET'S GO BRANDON!

 



UNSTOPPABLE!

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Posts: 5702
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Certainly the pandemic has affected many things from creating labor shortages, to supply chain issues. It has also caused shortages of various consumer goods which makes their prices go up in the short term. While I never predicted that a pandemic specifically would happen in my lifetime, I was sure that periodically humanity would deal with economic struggles from time to time. It's why I chose to go into a trade, because I wanted to always be able to find employment even in a down economy. Cars break every bit as frequently whether there is a pandemic or not. In 2020 when so many people were out of work, I made more money than I ever had. Work has been steady, and I expect that in May when the union contract is up for renewal, the labor shortage will be an excellent negotiating point.

I guess what I fail to understand is why you aren't absolutely killing it right now. You have an excellent situation where you are self employed with your own shop. You charge less than a dealership, and with your lower overhead, end up with a better margin. All of this during a time when a chip shortage is causing people to keep their cars on the road instead of buying a new one. On paper anyway it seems like it should be an ideal situation for a self employed mechanic like yourself. The only thing I can think of that might cause an issue is the shortage of auto parts that I have definitely noticed at the dealership. With Ford, the regional parts distribution center is in Menomonie Wisconsin, and half of their crew has been out with Covid, so our daily shipments haven't exactly been daily. Also, even when they were at full strength, so many of Ford's suppliers are having problems meeting demand, so LOTS of things are on back order that used to be available next day.

__________________

"If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you."     Lyndon B. Johnson

BLACK LIVES MATTER

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