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Auto-Trend Repairs and Service Information Forums -> Money, Business, Technology and Politics -> Motherfucker, so this is why I have to pay in $3500 to the IRS this year
Post Info TOPIC: Motherfucker, so this is why I have to pay in $3500 to the IRS this year
How are your 2018 tax returns? [4 vote(s)]

Less of a refund than usual
50.0%
More of a refund than usual
25.0%
Pay in for the first time EVER
25.0%
Pay in more than usual
0.0%
Pay in less than usual
0.0%
PowerStroker


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Motherfucker, so this is why I have to pay in $3500 to the IRS this year
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http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/02/heres-why-your-tax-refund-is-lower-this-year.html

Trump Tax Cuts Are (Probably) About to Become a Political Disaster

By Eric Levitz
 
 
 
At about this time one year ago, things werent looking good for the GOP. In the wake of a special Senate election in Alabama in which the Republican Party had rallied behind the failed candidacy of a theocratic ephebophile  Democrats had jumped out to a commanding lead in the congressional generic ballot. Money was flooding into Team Blues campaign coffers. Republican incumbents were heading for the revolving doors.

But GOP operatives insisted that the blue wave on the horizon would crest long before November  because the Trump Tax Cuts were about to kick in. Once voters saw fatter paychecks, Republicans would see better poll numbers. And just to be sure that voters noticed all the good Paul Ryan had done for them, the Trump administration reportedly pressured the IRS to err on the side of withholding too little from Americans paychecks so people will see big increases in their take-home pay ahead of this years midterm elections.

This did not work out as planned. Even with (allegedly) light withholding, the the tax bills breaks for middle-class people werent large enough to attract much notice. Between changes in salaries, health-care premiums, and 401(k) contributions, most Americans didnt detect much tax relief in their paychecks. The Trump Tax Cuts actually became less popular after they took effect. And, of course, Paul Ryans majority drowned in a blue wave.

Now, the bill for the GOPs (reported) withholding shenanigans is coming due: The average Americans tax refund was 8.4 percent lower in the first week of 2019 than it was one year ago (under the pre-Trump tax code). And while Americans have trouble noticing tax changes when theyre dispersed across 12 to 24 separate paychecks, they do typically pay very close attention to the size of their refunds. About three-quarters of the country typically qualifies for a tax refund most years and for many of those households, that check from the IRS is the largest lump sum theyll receive all year.

 

Ask people how much they paid in taxes, nobody knows. Ask them how much they got in their refund, people know, Howard Gleckman , a senior fellow at the Tax Policy Center, told the Intercepts David Dayen this week. Everyone focuses on size of the refund, and it does affect perception.

In other words: It looks as though the Republican Party implemented their signature tax bill in a manner that will lead many people who received tax cuts to believe that Donald Trump raised their taxes.

Now, were only one week into tax season. And it isnt 100 percent certainthat the IRSs withholding tables were way off. But current evidence suggests they were. And if thats the case, then the GOPs efforts to game withholding wont just lend credence to the Democrats most hyperbolic attacks on the Trump Tax Cuts they could also depress economic growth as the 2020 campaign gets under way. As Dayen explains:

[Americans] plan consumer purchases, particularly durable goods and big-ticket items, around [tax refunds]. Theres an entire cottage industry of refund advance loans, where filers get refunds immediately from their tax preparer and pay them back when the IRS completes the return  102 million taxpayers received refunds last year, with an average of $2,778. And most of those went out the door for some wish-list item or a crucial household necessity that had been put off.

 

If refunds do come back lower, experts agree that there will be a decided impact on consumer spending, as those big-ticket items dont get purchased. To the extent that filers rely on their refund for necessities, it could have more dire consequences than just slower economic growth.

Running for reelection on the strength of a failed attempt to throw millions off of health insurance and a tax cut that did a lot for the rich, and only a little for the middle-class seems hard. Doing so after youve accidentally led millions of Americans to (falsely) believe that you raised their taxes seems harder.

 
 
 
 
 


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Man...

To have to find 3.5K after already paying tax all year, really sux...

It happened to me once, the exact same figure too, ( way too complicated to explain ), but I contested the decision, & won after a long, drawn-out waste-of-time-&-money investigation, that found the Tax dept. at fault...

No apology was given to me, but an excuse that errors from time-to-time happen, & a thank-you for not being abusive throughout the process time.

May be time to go underground with that lathe PS....

Almost forgot, Nancy, 2020...



-- Edited by Rastus on Sunday 10th of February 2019 09:30:17 PM

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You should fire your accountant.

I got more than in previous years plus my son turned 17 just four days before the end of the year so I didnt get his child tax credit this year. You liberals are all FOS trying to blame this administration on poor tax returns.

Youre self employed now PowerStroker so there is a $3k self employment tax right there off the bat! Thank your liberal friends for that one buddy! You could also get married and have a few kids which would drastically reduce your taxes for being a productive member of society but that means you would have to think of others more than yourself on a daily basis! Your current political feelings arent exactly the same as caring for others who are dependent on you.

Thank all your liberal policies for the tax increase!



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I've got the money to pay it, but it's not an insignificant amount to me. You see, I'm not like Nuffan who generally has about 30 grand just for "walking around money," and another 50K that just fell into his couch cushions.

Rex, do you really measure someones productivity in society by how many kids they have?

I worked with a guy who had 12 kids, and he was one of the biggest drains on society I have ever met. Even going so far as to steal leftover chicken patties from a work luncheon, toilet paper, light bulbs, and automotive fluids from work to support his idiotic reproductive decisions. The automotive fluids he stole by the way, he would charge his children for when he fixed their cars.

I might suggest that the number of kids one has is really not an indication of how productive they are in society, and in some cases can indicate quite the opposite.

With regard to my accounting, I claim 1 exemption for myself, and previously it has always resulted in me getting a refund at the end of the year. My main source of income is my regular dealership job, but my side business only made about 5 grand more than last year, yet for the first time EVER I have to pay in. And for what I ask? Well because for political reasons the IRS was directed to give employers skewed withholding charts so it would give the false appearance that I was taking home more from my regular job in order to help Republicans in the midterms. They knew full well that we would get stuck at the end of the year making up the difference. That's some shady shit right there... Not surprising, but shady as fuck.

How did it work by the way, did you guys make great gains in the midterms? No, well this kind of shit is the reason why.



-- Edited by PowerStroker on Sunday 10th of February 2019 11:49:42 PM

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PowerStroker wrote:

I've got the money to pay it, but it's not an insignificant amount to me. You see, I'm not like Nuffan who generally has about 30 grand just for "walking around money," and another 50K that just fell into his couch cushions.

That is pretty funny PowerStroker, considering Nuffan was just bitching about the lack of an ignore button! LOL, he didn't mention anyone by name though. Of course you have a lot of money sitting around PowerStroker! You're reaching middle age without any dependents or wife! You should be ROLLING IN THE CASH! Your business is either in it's infancy and still running at a loss, or you just suck at business... Usually they say 5 years, but I have found small one man business may see over 10 years running at a loss before things are stable enough to churn even the EIC numbers on paper. Still, most of what I have is no longer liquid as my insurance company only covers $2k of liquidity in the household at one time. I am not hurting by any means, but I am not living it up either! The kids however, well I want them to look back on fond memories so I am carrying that for now - even though only one of my kids is eligible for a deduction now. 

Rex, do you really measure someones productivity in society by how many kids they have?

Well you know PowerStroker, we're all going to eventually die. What will live on to represent your genetics? Even if not your genetics, your teachings? If you feel civilization is nothing but a disease then by all means self-cleans! LOL, you never know who might be the next one to advance civilization next! Could have been your son or daughter, or children of theirs. It is more work to provide for a family than it is for yourself, it is more noble! In fact it is the only reason you are here today reading this!

I worked with a guy who had 12 kids, and he was one of the biggest drains on society I have ever met. Even going so far as to steal leftover chicken patties from a work luncheon, toilet paper, light bulbs, and automotive fluids from work to support his idiotic reproductive decisions. The automotive fluids he stole by the way, he would charge his children for when he fixed their cars.

As someone who buys these things I sure don't like to think about people stealing. It is not really the loss of money more than the betrayal - but at some point you have to kick-back to people who are spending 5-6 days away from their families and is making you a much larger ROI.. People like this are often watched, and if they get too greedy - or fail to turn a profit, they will be terminated because of it. If he keeps making the company money, the company will continue to wipe his and his entire families ass but it does not set a good example. Management knew about it, maybe was even docking his pay - you just don't know. Having 12 kids I am sure he was charging them, teaching them some responsibility! I am positive he wasn't charging them full boat, but enough to cover his cost and allow him to support the other 11 kids the best he can. 

I might suggest that the number of kids one has is really not an indication of how productive they are in society, and in some cases can indicate quite the opposite.

Sure, the parents might be nuts - but their kids will carry on this country well after we are gone! They will one day be taking care of YOU and running your country PowerStroker! 

With regard to my accounting, I claim 1 exemption for myself, and previously it has always resulted in me getting a refund at the end of the year. My main source of income is my regular dealership job, but my side business only made about 5 grand more than last year, yet for the first time EVER I have to pay in. And for what I ask? Well because for political reasons the IRS was directed to give employers skewed withholding charts so it would give the false appearance that I was taking home more from my regular job in order to help Republicans in the midterms. They knew full well that we would get stuck at the end of the year making up the difference. That's some shady shit right there... Not surprising, but shady as fuck.

Obviously you made more money dip-shit! Got $50k falling out of couch cushions, $30k flash cash... Nothing wrong with that! But pay your fucking taxes, PRICK! lol! How can you claim to be a liberal up in here whining about your self employment tax while also working for the man!? Your dumb ass probably doesn't even know how to deduct for business expenses and that is the ONLY reason you are paying taxes! Most people in your situation, working for the man and moonlighting entrepreneurs are doing so for the tax shelter! Nothing wrong with that if you are building a company that will one day employe people and turn a profit! In fact, if you have been in business for less than 10 years and NOT showing a net loss many times over then you're just an idiot who wants to look good on paper. Trump knows this, and it is probably the main reason he will not release his taxes! As a business owner you HAVE to write off every damned expense and even show a loss when you are doling out the time and money to get a business off the ground! It isn't cheap! The only thing shady as fuck here is you claiming to have $80k liquid, yet sneezing at paying $3,500 in taxes for all your jackass liberal causes. Sheesh...  

How did it work by the way, did you guys make great gains in the midterms? No, well this kind of shit is the reason why.

It is the natural ebb and flow progression of politics PowerStroker! A tragedy and comedy duality much like the ying and the yang... Positive and Negative, it's all ridiculously familiar yet could change in an instant. Welcome to life pal, pull up a chair and crack open a cold one!

 



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You misunderstand, I'm not whining about paying taxes, nor am I bitching about my tax rate... I'm bitching that not enough was withheld from my paychecks INTENTIONALLY because political hacks pressured the IRS to publish skewed withholding charts. This is going to screw over a great many people my friend.

Have you done your taxes yet?



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My taxes were done and filed on the 29th PowerStroker.

I understand what you mean about the 3k hit though... once a year I used to take the same hit around summer property tax time, but now I have escrow so when that statement comes in I think nothing of it.

I think what REALLY happened here was you made more than you expected and didn't utilize your business deductions enough - or perhaps you just didn't have any business expenses that caused you to come out of pocket. I am sure next year you will be better informed on this minor issue... just think, some people haven't filed since Obamacare for fear of being fined! And they probably still don't have insurance! 

As a Tax paying American, pretty please; with sugar on top - pay your fucking taxes. Lots of illegals rely on you every day!



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Oh, and by the way - there is 10,000+ more of them heading this way in caravans, as we speak!

That's a lot of mouths to feed your highness!

 



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PowerStroker wrote:

You misunderstand, I'm not whining about paying taxes, nor am I bitching about my tax rate... I'm bitching that not enough was withheld from my paychecks INTENTIONALLY because political hacks pressured the IRS to publish skewed withholding charts. This is going to screw over a great many people my friend.

Have you done your taxes yet?

 

 

Funny it did not have an impact on my withholdings...

 

wonder why my company withheld the correct amounts...Did my company get different withholding tables?

 

my refund is about $500 less than 2017 but I paid $2100 LESS in Federal Taxes 2018 than I did in 2017...

 

 



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I'm sure it's affecting everybody differently. I filled out a new W4 telling my employer to withhold another 3% which should reduce the amount I pay in next year.

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PowerStroker wrote:

I'm sure it's affecting everybody differently. I filled out a new W4 telling my employer to withhold another 3% which should reduce the amount I pay in next year.

 Or you are just full of shit...

 

As you claimed it was the president and you claim he did it deliberately...

Just seems like my employer would have gotten the same bad withholding charts...

In the end it is your responsibility...

But typical LEFTIST narrative...it is ALWAYS someone else's fault...

 

 



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There is reporting that this was done on purpose for political reasons. Is your dispute with the reporting, or with me for making it known?

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PowerStroker, it does seem like liberals are trying to make a thing of something that is not an issue - aka "false narrative".

I know first hand that my return was bigger this year, and that is even taking into account one of my kids turning 17 and not being eligible for the child tax credit! 

The money you claim to owe this year is the result of your employer and or your chosen withholding percentage - and not that of the Republicans, IRS or even the President. 

Sure, we want to hear anything you have to report - but what you suggest was not what I experienced this year.

Wasn't there an issue at one time with conservative organizations getting discriminated against for tax exempt status back when Obama was in office? Are you suggesting the IRS is targeting liberals?

You claim the Trump tax cuts are going to be a political disaster.. is that the aim of the Democrats? 



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No, I'm not suggesting the IRS is targeting liberals, in fact i'm sure a slight majority of their employees are probably liberal. Nor am I saying my employer is responsible for this. I'm stating that this is the first year that I have had to pay in without having made any changes to my withholding. I initially didn't think much of it, until I found news articles describing this happening to a lot of people, along with seemingly credible reporting that the IRS was specifically instructed to publish withholding charts that were skewed toward not having employers withhold enough from their employees generally. All for the purpose of falsely inflating peoples paychecks to help in the midterm elections. I'm honestly glad you weren't affected by this, I was, and I have taken measures to compensate for it next year. This weekend I will finish up my paperwork and pay my fair share to Uncle Sam. Gotta keep those illegals well fed you know, even though the billionaire class is likely to raid the treasury again before it gets to them anyway.

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PowerStroker wrote:

 This weekend I will finish up my paperwork and pay my fair share to Uncle Sam.

 LOL,

Uncle Sam may well get some, but it's after the Queen of England passes it on.

By your own Constitution, & as an American Citizen, there is no law that states you heave to pay tax, or even go to court. It's only through old  International Maritime Law directives that you agree to do so.



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PowerStroker wrote:

There is reporting that this was done on purpose for political reasons. Is your dispute with the reporting, or with me for making it known?

It is democrats trying to build a false narrative that middle class did not get a tax cut because their refund was lower...

BOTTOM LINE all tax payers paid less federal tax in 2018 than they did in 2017...

Which is typical...you seem to love false narratives...

 



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Rastus wrote:
PowerStroker wrote:

 This weekend I will finish up my paperwork and pay my fair share to Uncle Sam.

 LOL,

Uncle Sam may well get some, but it's after the Queen of England passes it on.

By your own Constitution, & as an American Citizen, there is no law that states you heave to pay tax, or even go to court. It's only through old  International Maritime Law directives that you agree to do so.

 

You might want to revisit the 16th amendment...

 



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Rastus wrote:

 

Uncle Sam may well get some, but it's after the Queen of England passes it on.

 

 

LOL!

After checking out the 16th amendment you should also look into that big party they had in Boston during the 1700's... 



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PowerStroker wrote:

No, I'm not suggesting the IRS is targeting liberals, in fact i'm sure a slight majority of their employees are probably liberal. Nor am I saying my employer is responsible for this. I'm stating that this is the first year that I have had to pay in without having made any changes to my withholding. I initially didn't think much of it, until I found news articles describing this happening to a lot of people, along with seemingly credible reporting that the IRS was specifically instructed to publish withholding charts that were skewed toward not having employers withhold enough from their employees generally. All for the purpose of falsely inflating peoples paychecks to help in the midterm elections. I'm honestly glad you weren't affected by this, I was, and I have taken measures to compensate for it next year. This weekend I will finish up my paperwork and pay my fair share to Uncle Sam. Gotta keep those illegals well fed you know, even though the billionaire class is likely to raid the treasury again before it gets to them anyway.

 

That is a lot of speculation, even for you! 

Could you maybe post some links to these skewed withholding charts because we're all baffled and we want to believe...



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https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/n1036.pdf

 

https://www.shrm.org/resourcesandtools/hr-topics/compensation/pages/irs-releases-2018-tax-withholding-tables.aspx

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/08/01/30-million-americans-are-not-withholding-enough-pay-for-taxes.html

 

I found the chart for 2019 which is the 1st link, so far I havent found them for previous years though.

I need to ask though. Is it really so hard to believe that the tax withholding tables would be skewed (at least for some tax brackets) toward not withholding enough for the sole purpose of falsely inflating peoples paychecks to help a political party during a midterm election? 

 

I mean COME ON... I post this with links to mainstream media coverage and I'm doubted by the very same people who don't even blink about conspiracy theories like:

1. Methane explosions in a sewer being proof positive that a secret underground complex for the New World Order is under construction.

2. Commercial airplanes are routinely spraying toxic chemicals for the purpose of engineering the climate.

3. The DNA of every citizen is on file for future cloning... Most likely to create an army of worker bees for the New World Order.

4. Obama wasn't born in Hawaii.

5. The Clintons have murdered more than 50 people.

6. Trump never hired prostitutes to pee in a hotel bed in which Obama once slept.

7. Bin Laden is secretly alive and hiding somewhere.

8. Aliens routinely visit earth in spacecraft that are apparently invisible to NORAD.

9. Trickle down and supply side economic theories are good for working people.

 

All of the aforementioned is absolutely believable to some, but the idea the IRS was pressured to adjust some charts is absolutely impossible, amazing.

By the way, I never said I paid more in taxes for 2018 than I did in 2017. I am fully aware that I am still in the temporary working class tax cut that allowed the skids to be greased enough to pass the big permanent (unless and until repealed someday) tax cut for big businesses. What I said was not enough was withheld from my paychecks which has caused me to need to pay in this year. This is a very different thing than saying I have higher taxes than I previously did. So I ask exactly who is trying to create a false narrative? 



-- Edited by PowerStroker on Tuesday 12th of February 2019 09:47:51 PM

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PowerStroker wrote:

 

https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/n1036.pdf

 

https://www.shrm.org/resourcesandtools/hr-topics/compensation/pages/irs-releases-2018-tax-withholding-tables.aspx

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/08/01/30-million-americans-are-not-withholding-enough-pay-for-taxes.html

 

I found the chart for 2019 which is the 1st link, so far I havent found them for previous years though.

I need to ask though. Is it really so hard to believe that the tax withholding tables would be skewed (at least for some tax brackets) toward not withholding enough for the sole purpose of falsely inflating peoples paychecks to help a political party during a midterm election? 

 

I mean COME ON... I post this with links to mainstream media coverage and I'm doubted by the very same people who don't even blink about conspiracy theories like:

1. Methane explosions in a sewer being proof positive that a secret underground complex for the New World Order is under construction.

2. Commercial airplanes are routinely spraying toxic chemicals for the purpose of engineering the climate.

3. The DNA of every citizen is on file for future cloning... Most likely to create an army of worker bees for the New World Order.

4. Obama wasn't born in Hawaii.

5. The Clintons have murdered more than 50 people.

6. Trump never hired prostitutes to pee in a hotel bed in which Obama once slept.

7. Bin Laden is secretly alive and hiding somewhere.

8. Aliens routinely visit earth in spacecraft that are apparently invisible to NORAD.

9. Trickle down and supply side economic theories are good for working people.

 

All of the aforementioned is absolutely believable to some, but the idea the IRS was pressured to adjust some charts is absolutely impossible, amazing.

By the way, I never said I paid more in taxes for 2018 than I did in 2017. I am fully aware that I am still in the temporary working class tax cut that allowed the skids to be greased enough to pass the big permanent (unless and until repealed someday) tax cut for big businesses. What I said was not enough was withheld from my paychecks which has caused me to need to pay in this year. This is a very different thing than saying I have higher taxes than I previously did. So I ask exactly who is trying to create a false narrative? 



-- Edited by PowerStroker on Tuesday 12th of February 2019 09:47:51 PM

 

 

 

It is not that it is completely unbelievable...Something like that could have happened...

 

It just didn't...

 

What you will find out if you look into it, is the people who did not have enough withheld was because their employer used the older tax charts...using the older charts under the new tax laws would cause people to not withhold enough and they would owe...not the bullshit narrative that the Trump administration did it to fuck the middle class...lol

 

what an ignorant motherfucker you are...

 



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^^^ You provided a perfectly believable, and hopefully true explanation. Then, in the same breath proceeded to insult me before I could even tell you as much.

You've clearly spent your life becoming a grand master of all things shit, but did you know you'll actually catch more flies with honey?



-- Edited by PowerStroker on Wednesday 13th of February 2019 12:04:51 AM

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PowerStroker wrote:

^^^ You provided a perfectly believable, and hopefully true explanation. Then, in the same breath proceeded to insult me before I could even tell you as much.

You've clearly spent your life becoming a grand master of all things shit, but did you know you'll actually catch more flies with honey?

 

 

I should mention, PowerStroker, that you had absolutely NO PROBLEMS taxing / fining the hell out of poor people to get your Obamacare enacted as law, so forgive the overall perceived lack of sympathy. The people that the ACA tax hit are the absolute poorest of the poor and the fines levied may as well been 90% of their pay because they don't have it sitting in their couch cushion. It is not that I don't care, it is that I really feel that YOU don't care - so long as you get your way. Based on your list of "I believes" in the previous thread it is quite clear you have very communistic / socialistic views. You champion 70+% tax on successful people and bellow and whine about an error you made in withholdings - knowing full well the tax laws had changed and blaming Republicans because while at the same time you agree with 70+% taxes on some, you're sniveling over what amounts to 3% tax on yourself. That is not exactly what many would consider "equality".

I never understood the whole catching flies with honey thing... Who the hell wants to attract flies? Unless you're a pile of shit.



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I have tried to make clear it's not the tax I have a problem with, it's the news reporting that the withholding amount was adjusted for political reasons. I think we have pretty well beat this horse to death by now.

Obamacare overall helped lower income people with subsidies for insurance. This lead to a huge expansion of the number of people covered, and a reduction in people using the ER as primary healthcare without ever paying the bill.



-- Edited by PowerStroker on Wednesday 13th of February 2019 06:52:01 AM

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That is why coverage at the bronze level is absolutely worthless unless you're hit by a bus... 

It is also why the outrageously overpriced coverage at the Gold level still isn't good enough for the lawmakers who put this law into effect. 

Obamacare is on it's deathbed, and so is the Democrat party. 

Have a nice day!



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Nuffan


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PowerStroker wrote:

I have tried to make clear it's not the tax I have a problem with, it's the news reporting that the withholding amount was adjusted for political reasons. I think we have pretty well beat this horse to death by now.

Obamacare overall helped lower income people with subsidies for insurance. This lead to a huge expansion of the number of people covered, and a reduction in people using the ER as primary healthcare without ever paying the bill.



-- Edited by PowerStroker on Wednesday 13th of February 2019 06:52:01 AM

 

 

That was the premise...ONLY that just never quite worked as intended...

 

And I know I have been in Healthcare Informatics for 27 years...

 

The part democrats always GLOSS over is subsidies only help pay the premium...

 

They leave out the coverage was CRAP did not cover much and had huge deductibles...meaning PEOPLE still were not going to the doctor until they were so sick they had to go to an ER...

 

When a poor family gets a healthcare plan with a 5K annual deductible, they get to keep the coverage because of the subsidies...but the subsidies does not pay ONE CENT of the 5K deductible...

 

THIS is why the ACA did not work as intended (advertised)...

 

Democrats blamed states not expanding Medicaid...and I will give them that did not help...but it did not actually matter because the ACA did not work as advertised, even in states that did actually expand Medicaid...

 

The ACA was WRITTEN by the insurance industry...it was setup to allow the insurance industry to sell cheap high deductible plans to people who rarely got sick (YOUNGER POPULATION) So they could collect massive premiums with little to nothing going out...as those people never covered their deductible so the insurance company was never liable...problem was it also allowed the poor to buy those same plans...and because those plans were the cheapest those were the plans the poor bought...

 

It was never well thought out...IT WAS CLEARLY RUSHED...(Never read) before becoming law...it only worked well for Insurance industry CEO who saw RECORD SETTING PROFITS and CEO pay sky rocket...but the democrats always leave that part out also...

 

 

 



-- Edited by Nuffan on Wednesday 13th of February 2019 08:19:20 AM

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You're not wrong Nuffan, and you just made a powerful argument for single payer universal coverage, like what we really wanted to begin with. Good on you sir!

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Nuffan


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PowerStroker wrote:

You're not wrong Nuffan, and you just made a powerful argument for single payer universal coverage, like what we really wanted to begin with. Good on you sir!

 

I am a fan of single payer...

It does come with it's own set of problems...

The biggest one is since the tax payer becomes the financially responsible party rather than the individual...who gets the final authority over treatment?

That is the door single payer opens...and there is no easy way around it from a legislative approach...

 

 

 

 



-- Edited by Nuffan on Wednesday 13th of February 2019 03:27:16 PM

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Nuffan


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And do not kid yourself...

 

DEMOCRATS were well paid for the ACA...they had no intentions of passing single payer...

 

Pulease tell me you realize the John Lieberman vote preventing single payer was a complete horse and pony show...



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I a a HUGE fan of Ben Shapiro...

 

I do not agree with him on abortion, but I respect his argument...

 

I am Pro Choice as long as it occurs within the first trimester...

 

after the first trimester I believe the fetus constitutes a life...as it can survive on it own from that point (not with great odds but that is a different debate) 

 

While I do believe a free market approach is viable...the profit motive can steer the industry in a manner that devalues life...where to draw the line on regulatory to protect the consumer...and not drive the cost through the roof...and not allow the for profit side doctors and facilities to gouge since it is the tax payer footing the bill...

So for single payer to work...it would have to be highly regulated which is 180 from a free market...There lies the paradox...

 

 

 

 



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PowerStroker is in the Union... He pays a Union to negotiate his labor and "look out for him", because he can't handle such responsibilities...

Where was your union on this one buddy?

Make sure them dues payments get paid on time though!

LOL



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SELLC


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PowerStroker does not blame his Union, or his H&R department - or even himself...

He blames Republicans - specifically President Trump! LOL

PowerStroker busted a knuckle while servicing a vehicle the other day and screamed out "Damn you Trump"! lol



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Shawnee_B


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PowerStroker wrote:

I mean COME ON... I post this with links to mainstream media coverage and I'm doubted by the very same people who don't even blink about conspiracy theories like:

1. Methane explosions in a sewer being proof positive that a secret underground complex for the New World Order is under construction.

2. Commercial airplanes are routinely spraying toxic chemicals for the purpose of engineering the climate.

3. The DNA of every citizen is on file for future cloning... Most likely to create an army of worker bees for the New World Order.

4. Obama wasn't born in Hawaii.

5. The Clintons have murdered more than 50 people.

6. Trump never hired prostitutes to pee in a hotel bed in which Obama once slept.

7. Bin Laden is secretly alive and hiding somewhere.

8. Aliens routinely visit earth in spacecraft that are apparently invisible to NORAD.

9. Trickle down and supply side economic theories are good for working people.

 

 

 1) partly correct, not the NWO part

2) Not commercial planes.

3) impossible

4) Correct. He actually used Kenya as his birth place for near 16 years. 2004 when he got senate they realized it would hurt his presidential aspirations and it changed to HA in 2006. Literary agent, something to do with his books. I know how you love snopes so here's one, they say "true".  https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/promotional-booklet/

5) Easily. Murrah blew 4 days before HRC would go on trial, oops all paperwork was in the building.

6) Believe that you're beyond help. Most of the left "wants" to believe it. Proven bullshit dossier.

7) Wrong. OBL died in either a cave or CIA safehouse almost a decade prior. He was on dialysis. Obama knew this and admitted it but 2 years until you will hear of it

8) Wrong. I was in NORAD and we don't miss anything! And act unless told to stand down like 9/11

9) Never cared for that line.

We need a conspiracy theory thread, got many new ones for you biggrin

 



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Oh goodie

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I know you love these :)

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Nuffan wrote:

Pulease tell me you realize the John Lieberman vote preventing single payer was a complete horse and pony show...

I know Max Baucus was against it too. Lately he has changed his tune, but a whole hell of a lot that does for us now. I'm sure there were some others who did not want to be put in a position to vote on it, so it was killed in committee. Actually I think it was the public option (Medicare buy in) that would have competed with for profit companies in the exchanges that was killed by Lieberman... I don't think single payer was even being seriously considered by any of the Senate committees with jurisdiction. An unfortunate result of special interest money in politics, and an argument for public funding for elections if you ask me.

Lieberman (The former Democratic senator from Aetna) is a corrupt bastard who I have long referred to as the poop stain on the shorts of Connecticut.

 

It is gratifying that we really aren't that far apart on healthcare policy. See, maybe I'm not totally evil after all and just mostly evil?



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Nuffan


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Obama birth place...

 

not that it matters anymore he WAS president for eight years...lol

 

I actually think he was born in Hawaii...

 

I think the Kenya born was FAKED to get him foreign aid to pay for his rather expensive education...and this is why his college records were sealed...

 

It all had to be completely covered up for him to run for president...

 

He went to Columbia and then Harvard...both very EXPENSIVE schools...

 

 



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We don't tolerate that kind of truth or logic around here bro.

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Don't know Nuffan, I don't think he was for many reasons. We've been over them but I did start a conspiracy theory thread. Good place to talk it out again.

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Shawnee_B wrote:

Don't know Nuffan, I don't think he was for many reasons. We've been over them but I did start a conspiracy theory thread. Good place to talk it out again.

  Good answer !

SELLC did lot's of snuffing-around with this issue, & already plenty of posts & facts(lol) are in here somewhere...I love the feet-prints LOL !!! So all we have to do is ask Mr.Obama to stand in a heap of ink, & walk on some paper for a comparison test LOL.

I bet Mr.Kissinger has ALL the answers...But we have to wait a full 5-years after his death, before all of his meddling's are allowed to be revealed...

The people of the US-of-A have the right to know if their President is a crook.



-- Edited by Rastus on Wednesday 13th of February 2019 08:54:47 PM

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Yo, yes the footprints were a good one. I have also posted much on the issue. Just far too much does not add up. I'll put my thoughts in the other thread tomorrow.

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You see, PowerStroker! You're filing your taxes all wrong!

This guy in Florida got a $980,000 refund check with only $18,000 of reported income! We need to get with this guys accountant! 

https://www.foxnews.com/us/florida-mans-980g-refund-check-from-irs-was-first-clue-something-was-wrong-report

No doubts that the guy probably lives in Broward County.. biggrin



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Kamala Harris just pushed the narrative that the tax cuts were not real and they were in fact taking from the middle class to line the pockets of the wealthy...

 

This is stupid...it is like AOC claim unemployment is down because people are working two jobs...lol

 

Taxes were cut and the calculation was simplified...

 

Middle Class America got to keep a lot more of the money they earned...

 

If you want your tax refund to be some form of forced savings make adjustments to your W4...you can have additional money withheld...

 

Truth: MIDDLE CLASS AMERICA PAID LESS IN TAXES IN 2018

 

Kamala Harris narrative...lets call the President's tax cuts what it is: a MIDDLE CLASS TAX HIKE to line the pockets of the wealthy....This is a direct quote from her twitter...

 

Another in a LONG LINE of false narratives...






-- Edited by Nuffan on Thursday 14th of February 2019 07:12:25 AM

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PowerStroker wrote:

We don't tolerate that kind of truth or logic around here bro.

 

I am not a fan of Obama...that has nothing to do with the color of his skin...it has everything to do with his leftist mentality...

 

Obama is at the root of what has destroyed the democratic party...

 

He took a LIBERAL party and took it way to the LEFT...

 

Obama entered office as a LIBERAL and he was a LEFTIST before the end of his first term...

 

When he faced majority opposition he forced his agenda...

 

unlike Reagan who simply made a bad deal...He got his tax cuts...in return he allowed Congress to spend with no remorse...

 

We will now see what Donald Trump does with the precedent Obama set...

 

 

 



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as to the poll

 

Honestly my return was down about $900 Federal...

 

but this is the part that matters...

 

in 2018 I made $15,000 more than I made in 2017

 

in 2018 I paid $2700 less in Federal withholding than I paid in 2017 even though I made $15,000 more...

 

and I still got back $3900 as opposed to the $4800 in 2017

 

 

 

I am MIDDLE CLASS...I make inside the top 10% and a good ways behind the top 1%. 

 

I MAKE LESS than ALEXANDRIA OCASIO-CORTEZ only I have been at my job (same company) 27 years...same career for 33 years...

 

LET THAT SINK IN...

 

And she wants to lecture me about income equality...LOL

 

Middle Class America paid less in taxes in 2018...by a very LARGE margin...



-- Edited by Nuffan on Thursday 14th of February 2019 08:38:26 AM

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0zaebtU-CA



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At the present time Senator Harris would be incorrect. However, because the tax cuts are entirely financed by adding to the debt, and there is no expiration in current law for corporate tax rates, yet there is an expiration in current law for family tax rates, the time will come when the debt will have to be paid back. This will occur after the middle tax cut will have expired whereupon working class people will begin subsidizing the continued tax cuts for billionaires and corporations.

Lets just hope the Dems can attain both houses of Congress and the White House before that happens and find a way to fix it, otherwise Senator Harris will be right.

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PowerStroker wrote:



Lets just hope the Dems can attain both houses of Congress and the White House before that happens and find a way to fix it, otherwise Senator Harris will be right.

 Dems couldn't pour piss out of a boot with instructions on the heel. Let alone fix anything.



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Shawnee_B wrote:
PowerStroker wrote:



Lets just hope the Dems can attain both houses of Congress and the White House before that happens and find a way to fix it, otherwise Senator Harris will be right.

 Dems couldn't pour piss out of a boot with instructions on the heel. Let alone fix anything.

 LOL !

That's why we have Nancy to take care of things !

Nancy, 2020 !



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Nancy will be in the looney bin by 2020, should be right now.

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